Comments on: Even Steel Goes Soft… http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2009/01/31/even_steel_goes/ All that flavorful brownness in one savory packet Sat, 30 Nov 2013 11:11:28 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: alc http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2009/01/31/even_steel_goes/comment-page-1/#comment-230142 alc Sat, 07 Feb 2009 23:54:13 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5616#comment-230142 <p>Great post. I agree. Continuing to prop up China's oh-so-dainty economy is good for America.</p> <p><em>sarcasm</em></p> Great post. I agree. Continuing to prop up China’s oh-so-dainty economy is good for America.

sarcasm

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By: TTCUSM http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2009/01/31/even_steel_goes/comment-page-1/#comment-230110 TTCUSM Fri, 06 Feb 2009 15:39:31 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5616#comment-230110 <p>I don't mean to threadjack or anything, but all this discussion of H1 visas has distracted us from the <i>real</i> issue:</p> <p>Summer is coming. Which means gas prices are going to go back up, unless we do something about it...</p> I don’t mean to threadjack or anything, but all this discussion of H1 visas has distracted us from the real issue:

Summer is coming. Which means gas prices are going to go back up, unless we do something about it…

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By: Pagal_Aadmi_for_debauchery http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2009/01/31/even_steel_goes/comment-page-1/#comment-229954 Pagal_Aadmi_for_debauchery Tue, 03 Feb 2009 22:33:40 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5616#comment-229954 <p><i>If you're in NYPD, you can't just quit and join the FBI. There's a process for it.</i></p> <p>Not that it matters, but, no, there is no process for leaving NYPD and joining the FBI. You resign from NYPD and then you join the FBI after going through their interview process. The FBI might do a reference check with NYPD just as they would do a reference check with KFC if thats where you were working before you applied for the FBI job.</p> If you’re in NYPD, you can’t just quit and join the FBI. There’s a process for it.

Not that it matters, but, no, there is no process for leaving NYPD and joining the FBI. You resign from NYPD and then you join the FBI after going through their interview process. The FBI might do a reference check with NYPD just as they would do a reference check with KFC if thats where you were working before you applied for the FBI job.

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By: MoorNam http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2009/01/31/even_steel_goes/comment-page-1/#comment-229938 MoorNam Tue, 03 Feb 2009 20:41:04 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5616#comment-229938 <p>PAFD: One does not need permission to leave a PS job - but there's a protocol to be followed when you leave a PS job to go to another PS job. If you're in NYPD, you can't just quit and join the FBI. There's a process for it. All I'm saying is that the same process should be applicable to people working in companies that took TARP money.</p> <p>M. Nam</p> PAFD: One does not need permission to leave a PS job – but there’s a protocol to be followed when you leave a PS job to go to another PS job. If you’re in NYPD, you can’t just quit and join the FBI. There’s a process for it. All I’m saying is that the same process should be applicable to people working in companies that took TARP money.

M. Nam

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By: Pagal_Aadmi_for_debauchery http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2009/01/31/even_steel_goes/comment-page-1/#comment-229936 Pagal_Aadmi_for_debauchery Tue, 03 Feb 2009 20:34:55 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5616#comment-229936 <p><i>- nobody working there should get a bonus. Ever. (Does anyone in DMV get a bonus?) - nobody working there should be allowed to quit and join another TARP company unless both companies approve. If you are working as a janitor for the DMV and want to work as a janitor for the public school, you need permission from both places. Similarly if you are working for Citigroup as an investment banker, you cannot go to JP Morgan unless your manager at Citigroup signs off on it. If you are working for GM as a lathe operator, you are prohibited from joining Chrysler as a lathe operator for the same reason (but you can join Ford since they did not take TARP money).</i></p> <p>You dont have to get permission from the employer to leave a public sector job. Also public sector employees do get bonuses. They are just not as big and pervasive as they are in the private sector.</p> <p><i>As long as the American public wants cheap goods, O/O are here to stay. Especially in this environment where households are being severely stretched, O/O will only increase.</i></p> <p>Yes, but that does not mean that its necessarily a good thing for America. Also the WTO does not cover restrictions on movement of services/employees so a simple federal legislation can disincentivize O/O.</p> - nobody working there should get a bonus. Ever. (Does anyone in DMV get a bonus?) - nobody working there should be allowed to quit and join another TARP company unless both companies approve. If you are working as a janitor for the DMV and want to work as a janitor for the public school, you need permission from both places. Similarly if you are working for Citigroup as an investment banker, you cannot go to JP Morgan unless your manager at Citigroup signs off on it. If you are working for GM as a lathe operator, you are prohibited from joining Chrysler as a lathe operator for the same reason (but you can join Ford since they did not take TARP money).

You dont have to get permission from the employer to leave a public sector job. Also public sector employees do get bonuses. They are just not as big and pervasive as they are in the private sector.

As long as the American public wants cheap goods, O/O are here to stay. Especially in this environment where households are being severely stretched, O/O will only increase.

Yes, but that does not mean that its necessarily a good thing for America. Also the WTO does not cover restrictions on movement of services/employees so a simple federal legislation can disincentivize O/O.

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By: MoorNam http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2009/01/31/even_steel_goes/comment-page-1/#comment-229934 MoorNam Tue, 03 Feb 2009 18:06:45 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5616#comment-229934 <blockquote> <blockquote> <p><i>I am not so sure that offshoring and outsourcing are good for the US.</i></p> </blockquote> </blockquote> <p>As long as the American public wants cheap goods, O/O are here to stay. Especially in this environment where households are being severely stretched, O/O will only increase.</p> <blockquote> <blockquote> <p>Maybe some restrictions on outsourcing could be put on the financial sector so they dont take billions of tax payers money and outsource/offshore jobs.</p> </blockquote> </blockquote> <p>Any company that takes in TARP money has to be treated as a Government company/Public Sector and there are already rules that restrict O/O in such companies. In addition:</p> <ul> <li>nobody working there should get a bonus. Ever. (Does anyone in DMV get a bonus?)</li> <li>nobody working there should be allowed to quit and join another TARP company unless both companies approve. If you are working as a janitor for the DMV and want to work as a janitor for the public school, you need permission from both places. Similarly if you are working for Citigroup as an investment banker, you cannot go to JP Morgan unless your manager at Citigroup signs off on it. If you are working for GM as a lathe operator, you are prohibited from joining Chrysler as a lathe operator for the same reason (but you can join Ford since they did not take TARP money).</li> </ul> <p>M. Nam</p>

I am not so sure that offshoring and outsourcing are good for the US.

As long as the American public wants cheap goods, O/O are here to stay. Especially in this environment where households are being severely stretched, O/O will only increase.

Maybe some restrictions on outsourcing could be put on the financial sector so they dont take billions of tax payers money and outsource/offshore jobs.

Any company that takes in TARP money has to be treated as a Government company/Public Sector and there are already rules that restrict O/O in such companies. In addition:

  • nobody working there should get a bonus. Ever. (Does anyone in DMV get a bonus?)
  • nobody working there should be allowed to quit and join another TARP company unless both companies approve. If you are working as a janitor for the DMV and want to work as a janitor for the public school, you need permission from both places. Similarly if you are working for Citigroup as an investment banker, you cannot go to JP Morgan unless your manager at Citigroup signs off on it. If you are working for GM as a lathe operator, you are prohibited from joining Chrysler as a lathe operator for the same reason (but you can join Ford since they did not take TARP money).

M. Nam

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By: Pagal_Aadmi_for_debauchery http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2009/01/31/even_steel_goes/comment-page-1/#comment-229933 Pagal_Aadmi_for_debauchery Tue, 03 Feb 2009 16:33:58 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5616#comment-229933 <p><i>And as for them mostly being in technical jobs - the article has them in jobs as investment analysts, <b>corporate law</b>, etc.</i></p> <p>I have not seen specific numbers, but there are hardly any H-1bs in Corporate Law.</p> <p>I agree with Vinod and others here on trade protectionism. However, I am not so sure that offshoring and outsourcing are good for the US. Maybe some restrictions on outsourcing could be put on the financial sector so they dont take billions of tax payers money and outsource/offshore jobs.</p> And as for them mostly being in technical jobs – the article has them in jobs as investment analysts, corporate law, etc.

I have not seen specific numbers, but there are hardly any H-1bs in Corporate Law.

I agree with Vinod and others here on trade protectionism. However, I am not so sure that offshoring and outsourcing are good for the US. Maybe some restrictions on outsourcing could be put on the financial sector so they dont take billions of tax payers money and outsource/offshore jobs.

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By: MoorNam http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2009/01/31/even_steel_goes/comment-page-1/#comment-229920 MoorNam Tue, 03 Feb 2009 02:57:22 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5616#comment-229920 <blockquote> <blockquote> <p><i>I have sympathy for the motivations of the people who are trying to protect their jobs - I just think they should do it in the name of worker rights</i></p> </blockquote> </blockquote> <p>How about they do it by being good at their job and charge competitive rates? Just a thought...</p> <p>M. Nam</p>

I have sympathy for the motivations of the people who are trying to protect their jobs – I just think they should do it in the name of worker rights

How about they do it by being good at their job and charge competitive rates? Just a thought…

M. Nam

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By: dr amonymous http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2009/01/31/even_steel_goes/comment-page-1/#comment-229917 dr amonymous Mon, 02 Feb 2009 23:35:53 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5616#comment-229917 <blockquote>Similarly, when there is no labor shortage, whether in the firm, the local area, or in the job category, hiring an H-1B cannot be justified as easily as during a boom. That would be unfair to the existing labor pool. That's why this should be looked at.</blockquote> <p>Essentially, you're arguing that the U.S. government, through immigration policy, ought to regulate its labor market so that it can take on no risk (since H-1Bs are trained in foreign countries) while accruing the benefits when it needs them (and making up for poor coordination between economic and educational policy). I think it is in that context of fairness that we ought to look at this. In a world in which some countries have per capita incomes at 48,000 PPP and others have $1,100, and capital is free to roam but labor is not, the argument that H-1B workers are in some sense taking jobs unfairly seems very narrow to me.</p> <p>However, I have sympathy for the motivations of the people who are trying to protect their jobs - I just think they should do it in the name of worker rights, not in the name of their citizenship status or nationalism. I also am fully aware that citizenship status (including temporary worker status) is used as a way to undercut labor organizing - and that's a huge problem. But I hope that another solution can be found than 'these are our jobs fullstop' (with concomitant racism xenophobia etc).</p> <p>I hope...</p> Similarly, when there is no labor shortage, whether in the firm, the local area, or in the job category, hiring an H-1B cannot be justified as easily as during a boom. That would be unfair to the existing labor pool. That’s why this should be looked at.

Essentially, you’re arguing that the U.S. government, through immigration policy, ought to regulate its labor market so that it can take on no risk (since H-1Bs are trained in foreign countries) while accruing the benefits when it needs them (and making up for poor coordination between economic and educational policy). I think it is in that context of fairness that we ought to look at this. In a world in which some countries have per capita incomes at 48,000 PPP and others have $1,100, and capital is free to roam but labor is not, the argument that H-1B workers are in some sense taking jobs unfairly seems very narrow to me.

However, I have sympathy for the motivations of the people who are trying to protect their jobs – I just think they should do it in the name of worker rights, not in the name of their citizenship status or nationalism. I also am fully aware that citizenship status (including temporary worker status) is used as a way to undercut labor organizing – and that’s a huge problem. But I hope that another solution can be found than ‘these are our jobs fullstop’ (with concomitant racism xenophobia etc).

I hope…

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By: umber desi http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2009/01/31/even_steel_goes/comment-page-1/#comment-229916 umber desi Mon, 02 Feb 2009 23:15:04 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5616#comment-229916 <p>Ex H1-B,</p> <p>Where is anyone saying that paying taxes is the rationale for hiring foreign workers? October and April 2008 are both in the same year, my point is that when banks received bail out money, October onwards, they couldn't be filing petitions for foreign workers (other than transfers) as the visa petitions are filed in April and the quota gets filled in relatively short time frame. Again, don't know what this has to do with writing off losses against previous years profits.</p> Ex H1-B,

Where is anyone saying that paying taxes is the rationale for hiring foreign workers? October and April 2008 are both in the same year, my point is that when banks received bail out money, October onwards, they couldn’t be filing petitions for foreign workers (other than transfers) as the visa petitions are filed in April and the quota gets filled in relatively short time frame. Again, don’t know what this has to do with writing off losses against previous years profits.

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