Comments on: Stratpage Updates on Pakistan http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/10/09/stratpage_updat/ All that flavorful brownness in one savory packet Sat, 30 Nov 2013 11:11:28 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Faiqa http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/10/09/stratpage_updat/comment-page-1/#comment-218162 Faiqa Sun, 12 Oct 2008 10:22:47 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5454#comment-218162 <p><b>@Moore</b> Yeah. Well said. Unfortunately. Sigh.</p> @Moore Yeah. Well said. Unfortunately. Sigh.

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By: Peter http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/10/09/stratpage_updat/comment-page-1/#comment-217966 Peter Fri, 10 Oct 2008 03:35:00 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5454#comment-217966 <p>off topic... on a language usage note:</p> <p>"sometimes skiddish"</p> <p>correct usage would be "sometimes skittish."</p> <p>"Skids" are what happens in your underwear, although in this context, "skiddish" may be quite appropriate.</p> off topic… on a language usage note:

“sometimes skiddish”

correct usage would be “sometimes skittish.”

“Skids” are what happens in your underwear, although in this context, “skiddish” may be quite appropriate.

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By: Moore http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/10/09/stratpage_updat/comment-page-1/#comment-217958 Moore Fri, 10 Oct 2008 02:16:54 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5454#comment-217958 <p>Military force will definitely be required to eliminate the radical Taliban and Al-Qaeda folks who have taken to fighting and suicide bombing. But this has to be accompanied by a massive resettling of Afghan refugees including socio-economic rehabilitation & development of Afghanistan and NWFP. Without this, US will be committing the same mistake as in the past when it just washed its hands off the region after its interests in the Soviet-war was satisfied. The only problem will be to deal with the entrenched networks amongst the radicals n NWFP who were in league with Pak army/ISI. US can't do much about it other than put pressure on Pak. The covert intrusions is a one way to apply this pressure by stick. But at the end of the day it is Pak which needs to realize the importance not supporting the radicals. Unfortuntely Pak's connections with the Islamic radicals in the entire country is a source of sustenance of their anti-India passion which is the lifeblood of their nationalism.</p> <p>Another catch with covert operations is that you are inflaming many elements in the army/ISI who in the past didn't like a wee bit the incursions of Pak air-space by Clinton's missile strike on Bin-Laden without any prior warning to the establishment. Interesting aspects of this story including the history from Afghan invasion to 9/11 is given in the following books - <a href="http://www.bookreporter.com/reviews/0374528861.asp">Pakistan: In the Shadow of Jihad and Afghanistan</a> by Mary Ann Weaver</p> <p><a href="http://www.ahmedrashid.com/2008/06/17/descent-into-chaos/">Descent into Chaos</a> by Ahmed Rashid</p> Military force will definitely be required to eliminate the radical Taliban and Al-Qaeda folks who have taken to fighting and suicide bombing. But this has to be accompanied by a massive resettling of Afghan refugees including socio-economic rehabilitation & development of Afghanistan and NWFP. Without this, US will be committing the same mistake as in the past when it just washed its hands off the region after its interests in the Soviet-war was satisfied. The only problem will be to deal with the entrenched networks amongst the radicals n NWFP who were in league with Pak army/ISI. US can’t do much about it other than put pressure on Pak. The covert intrusions is a one way to apply this pressure by stick. But at the end of the day it is Pak which needs to realize the importance not supporting the radicals. Unfortuntely Pak’s connections with the Islamic radicals in the entire country is a source of sustenance of their anti-India passion which is the lifeblood of their nationalism.

Another catch with covert operations is that you are inflaming many elements in the army/ISI who in the past didn’t like a wee bit the incursions of Pak air-space by Clinton’s missile strike on Bin-Laden without any prior warning to the establishment. Interesting aspects of this story including the history from Afghan invasion to 9/11 is given in the following books - Pakistan: In the Shadow of Jihad and Afghanistan by Mary Ann Weaver

Descent into Chaos by Ahmed Rashid

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By: bobby jindal http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/10/09/stratpage_updat/comment-page-1/#comment-217954 bobby jindal Fri, 10 Oct 2008 01:48:20 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5454#comment-217954 <p>The countdown has begun.</p> <p>1) The Nano car project was shifted from West Bengal to Gujarat 2) Indian national elections are on the horizon 3) The inevitable throning of Narendra Modi as the lion heart Prime Minister of India</p> <p>All hell will break loose.. when that happens..</p> <p>The chinese state supported candidate, the poster boy of Japanese industrial regeneration, the hope of South Korean capitalism, and finally a change in the new world order.</p> <p>Modi as prime minister will forever alter pakistan, south asia, indo-china, eurasia, the western hemisphere.</p> <p>As it has been said, by no less than nostradamus, one shall rise from the plains of the ganges, who shall engulf the masses of Arabia, destroy the hegemony of the west, and lead the world towards the end of Kalyuga</p> <p>Damn... Now how long will this stay on sepia mutiny ( i bet 26 seconds )</p> <p>Oooooh pakistan, your fate is gonna change soon...</p> The countdown has begun.

1) The Nano car project was shifted from West Bengal to Gujarat 2) Indian national elections are on the horizon 3) The inevitable throning of Narendra Modi as the lion heart Prime Minister of India

All hell will break loose.. when that happens..

The chinese state supported candidate, the poster boy of Japanese industrial regeneration, the hope of South Korean capitalism, and finally a change in the new world order.

Modi as prime minister will forever alter pakistan, south asia, indo-china, eurasia, the western hemisphere.

As it has been said, by no less than nostradamus, one shall rise from the plains of the ganges, who shall engulf the masses of Arabia, destroy the hegemony of the west, and lead the world towards the end of Kalyuga

Damn… Now how long will this stay on sepia mutiny ( i bet 26 seconds )

Oooooh pakistan, your fate is gonna change soon…

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By: sakshi http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/10/09/stratpage_updat/comment-page-1/#comment-217949 sakshi Fri, 10 Oct 2008 01:04:32 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5454#comment-217949 <blockquote>Rumours are that Zardari has now reached out to.....India!! I did read in a Business Standard article that Pakistan has been refused any help by 'friendly countries'. But then what countries are being referred to? He is already going to China, has China too refused him some money? Sounds strange since it helps China strategically too and it seems like he will be receiving a warm welcome in China. Why would he ask India for money if China can give him the same.</blockquote> <p>Also the Saudis.</p> Rumours are that Zardari has now reached out to…..India!! I did read in a Business Standard article that Pakistan has been refused any help by ‘friendly countries’. But then what countries are being referred to? He is already going to China, has China too refused him some money? Sounds strange since it helps China strategically too and it seems like he will be receiving a warm welcome in China. Why would he ask India for money if China can give him the same.

Also the Saudis.

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By: Ardy http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/10/09/stratpage_updat/comment-page-1/#comment-217934 Ardy Fri, 10 Oct 2008 00:01:17 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5454#comment-217934 <blockquote>Rumours are that Zardari has now reached out to.....India!! </blockquote> <p>I did read in a Business Standard article that Pakistan has been refused any help by 'friendly countries'. But then what countries are being referred to? He is already going to China, has China too refused him some money? Sounds strange since it helps China strategically too and it seems like he will be receiving a warm welcome in China. Why would he ask India for money if China can give him the same.</p> Rumours are that Zardari has now reached out to…..India!!

I did read in a Business Standard article that Pakistan has been refused any help by ‘friendly countries’. But then what countries are being referred to? He is already going to China, has China too refused him some money? Sounds strange since it helps China strategically too and it seems like he will be receiving a warm welcome in China. Why would he ask India for money if China can give him the same.

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By: Sh. Arpasand http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/10/09/stratpage_updat/comment-page-1/#comment-217929 Sh. Arpasand Thu, 09 Oct 2008 23:36:56 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5454#comment-217929 <p><i>1 · <b><a target="_blank" href="https://mail.google.com/mail?view=cm&tf=0&to=moornam@yahoo.com" rel="nofollow">MoorNam</a></b> <a href="http://www.sepiamutiny.com/sepia/archives/005454.html#comment217915">said</a></i></p> <blockquote> <i> Apparently, Pakistan apparently has only enough cash for a month or two. Zardari made futile attempts to raise cash from Western countries, who said that they have enough problems of their own. Rumours are that Zardari has now reached out to.....India!! Hence the sweet talk... </i> </blockquote> <p>This actually creates an interesting dilemma for India. On one hand there is really no reason for India to fund and support an arch rival, but at the same time India would not want a nuclear-armed neighbouring state to go into anarchy. Chaos and disintegration of Pak will also make India a (very) dangerous and unpredictable place. This is looking more and more like the wall-street crisis in the usa. India may very well have to bail-out Pak. All Zardari has to do is to point the gun to his own head and say to India "do as I say or I will shoot the black guy"</p> 1 · MoorNam said

Apparently, Pakistan apparently has only enough cash for a month or two. Zardari made futile attempts to raise cash from Western countries, who said that they have enough problems of their own. Rumours are that Zardari has now reached out to…..India!! Hence the sweet talk…

This actually creates an interesting dilemma for India. On one hand there is really no reason for India to fund and support an arch rival, but at the same time India would not want a nuclear-armed neighbouring state to go into anarchy. Chaos and disintegration of Pak will also make India a (very) dangerous and unpredictable place. This is looking more and more like the wall-street crisis in the usa. India may very well have to bail-out Pak. All Zardari has to do is to point the gun to his own head and say to India “do as I say or I will shoot the black guy”

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By: Sudeep http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/10/09/stratpage_updat/comment-page-1/#comment-217917 Sudeep Thu, 09 Oct 2008 21:03:29 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5454#comment-217917 <p>To understand Pakistan's problems in handling the NWFP region, you have to give it a little bit of context. Simple numbers as to how many soldiers/civilians/insurgents died, misses the historical picture of how insurgencies have been handled in Pakistan.</p> <p>Historically, Pakistans response to insurgencies has been to use a sledgehammer where a surgical scalpel is needed. For e.g. the 1970s uprising in Bangladesh, or the Shia revolt in POK, or the baluch insurgency. This approach is used with a complete absence of any 'win hearts/minds' approach. Its an all stick, no carrot approach. When the Pakistani army can, it tries to use its foster kid, the unofficial 'Army of Islam', to achieve its goals. Use of Bin Laden to put down Shias in Gilgit, Al Badr to ethnically cleanse Bangladesh of Hindus, use of the 'Mujaheddin' against the USSR and the ongoing confrontation in Jammu and Kashmir.</p> <p>Now, not only do they have to do their dirty work themselves, they also have to do it against their foster kids ! Pakistan is institutionally incapable of performing this mission with any amount of seriousness. Instead, we have arty regiments being used to flatten entire villages as communal punishment and fiercely independent and grudge bearing tribals exacting revenge on the helpless Frontier Constabulary. In such a context, the number of dead Pakistani soldiers/para mils and the number of dead civilians is simply a footnote and does not point to the actual situation on the ground.</p> <p>The fight to put down the insurgency in Afghanistan/NWFP will have to start in Islamabad, not Bajaur/Swat/...</p> To understand Pakistan’s problems in handling the NWFP region, you have to give it a little bit of context. Simple numbers as to how many soldiers/civilians/insurgents died, misses the historical picture of how insurgencies have been handled in Pakistan.

Historically, Pakistans response to insurgencies has been to use a sledgehammer where a surgical scalpel is needed. For e.g. the 1970s uprising in Bangladesh, or the Shia revolt in POK, or the baluch insurgency. This approach is used with a complete absence of any ‘win hearts/minds’ approach. Its an all stick, no carrot approach. When the Pakistani army can, it tries to use its foster kid, the unofficial ‘Army of Islam’, to achieve its goals. Use of Bin Laden to put down Shias in Gilgit, Al Badr to ethnically cleanse Bangladesh of Hindus, use of the ‘Mujaheddin’ against the USSR and the ongoing confrontation in Jammu and Kashmir.

Now, not only do they have to do their dirty work themselves, they also have to do it against their foster kids ! Pakistan is institutionally incapable of performing this mission with any amount of seriousness. Instead, we have arty regiments being used to flatten entire villages as communal punishment and fiercely independent and grudge bearing tribals exacting revenge on the helpless Frontier Constabulary. In such a context, the number of dead Pakistani soldiers/para mils and the number of dead civilians is simply a footnote and does not point to the actual situation on the ground.

The fight to put down the insurgency in Afghanistan/NWFP will have to start in Islamabad, not Bajaur/Swat/…

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By: MoorNam http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/10/09/stratpage_updat/comment-page-1/#comment-217915 MoorNam Thu, 09 Oct 2008 20:32:48 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5454#comment-217915 <blockquote> <blockquote> <p><i>Zardari also said that India was never a threat to Pakistan</i>.</p> </blockquote> </blockquote> <p>Apparently, Pakistan apparently has only enough cash for a month or two. Zardari made futile attempts to raise cash from Western countries, who said that they have enough problems of their own. Rumours are that Zardari has now reached out to.....India!! Hence the sweet talk...</p> <p>M. Nam</p>

Zardari also said that India was never a threat to Pakistan.

Apparently, Pakistan apparently has only enough cash for a month or two. Zardari made futile attempts to raise cash from Western countries, who said that they have enough problems of their own. Rumours are that Zardari has now reached out to…..India!! Hence the sweet talk…

M. Nam

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