Comments on: DNC Day 4: The Promise http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/08/29/dnc_day_4_the_p/ All that flavorful brownness in one savory packet Sat, 30 Nov 2013 11:11:28 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Huey http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/08/29/dnc_day_4_the_p/comment-page-1/#comment-214022 Huey Sun, 31 Aug 2008 16:11:52 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5382#comment-214022 <p>Thanks, Manju.</p> Thanks, Manju.

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By: Manju http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/08/29/dnc_day_4_the_p/comment-page-1/#comment-213983 Manju Sat, 30 Aug 2008 21:54:15 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5382#comment-213983 <p>Oops, that was MoorNam, not Heuy, to whom I was responding.</p> Oops, that was MoorNam, not Heuy, to whom I was responding.

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By: Manju http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/08/29/dnc_day_4_the_p/comment-page-1/#comment-213982 Manju Sat, 30 Aug 2008 21:52:16 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5382#comment-213982 <p><i>21 · <B><A href="mailto:southpaw2k1@yahoo.com" rel=nofollow>Huey</A></B> <a href="http://www.sepiamutiny.com/sepia/archives/005382.html#comment213851">said</a></i></p> <blockquote>Looks like Geraldine Ferrao was right all along.</blockquote> <p>the problem with ferraro's comments were they were half-truths; and half-truths are lies too. Of course Obama benefited from being black in some quarters. but thats b/c its such a disadvantage being black in the first place. to conclude, as ferror did, that the net result is he's "lucky" to be black is to decontextualize the good will his race brings him to the point of absurdity.</p> <p>Did jfk benefit from being catholic? with some, sure. did catholics vote for him largely b/c he's Catholic? i assume so. but the major reason he could generate such favoritism is b/c he's starting out with an unfair disadvantage to begin with.</p> <p>and ferrrao's comments were mde in a political campaign, meant to hurt obama, though its unclear why hillary isn't equally as lucky, perhaps more-so since demographics allow her to explicitly play identity politics while obama could not. in fact, this was a concerted effort to get obama to play the race card, since ferroro knew it was a losing card. He declined, smartly, but allowed surrogates to call her out and ferraor jumped at the opportunity, responding that they are only attacking her b/c she's white, doubling down on her bet.</p> <p>its a clever race baiting strategy b/c it has enough truth lurking in it to make it plausible. some do benefit from an AA mentality, like clarence thomas or arguably palin. but these individuals were appointed to their current position, and like rush's comment about the liberal media and donovan mcnabb, when a small elite makes a decision it is entirely possible a disadvantaged minority may benefit unfairly. but obama was in a election where huge swaths of voters would not choose him b/c of his race and presumed religion. ferror's bizarre theory of black privilege makes no sense in this context.</p> <p>ferraro's strategy almost directly parallels bill clinton's own odyssey during the primary, culminating in his accusation that obama played the race card on him. i don't think its a coincidence that ferroro was never asked to resign from the campaign. It was part of hillary's final hail mary attempt to seize the nom: divide among race, gender (ferraro also calle him sexist), religion, and throw in a little electioneering (mich and fl, not to mentio the earlier nv caucus lawsuit). came close to working.</p> 21 · Huey said

Looks like Geraldine Ferrao was right all along.

the problem with ferraro’s comments were they were half-truths; and half-truths are lies too. Of course Obama benefited from being black in some quarters. but thats b/c its such a disadvantage being black in the first place. to conclude, as ferror did, that the net result is he’s “lucky” to be black is to decontextualize the good will his race brings him to the point of absurdity.

Did jfk benefit from being catholic? with some, sure. did catholics vote for him largely b/c he’s Catholic? i assume so. but the major reason he could generate such favoritism is b/c he’s starting out with an unfair disadvantage to begin with.

and ferrrao’s comments were mde in a political campaign, meant to hurt obama, though its unclear why hillary isn’t equally as lucky, perhaps more-so since demographics allow her to explicitly play identity politics while obama could not. in fact, this was a concerted effort to get obama to play the race card, since ferroro knew it was a losing card. He declined, smartly, but allowed surrogates to call her out and ferraor jumped at the opportunity, responding that they are only attacking her b/c she’s white, doubling down on her bet.

its a clever race baiting strategy b/c it has enough truth lurking in it to make it plausible. some do benefit from an AA mentality, like clarence thomas or arguably palin. but these individuals were appointed to their current position, and like rush’s comment about the liberal media and donovan mcnabb, when a small elite makes a decision it is entirely possible a disadvantaged minority may benefit unfairly. but obama was in a election where huge swaths of voters would not choose him b/c of his race and presumed religion. ferror’s bizarre theory of black privilege makes no sense in this context.

ferraro’s strategy almost directly parallels bill clinton’s own odyssey during the primary, culminating in his accusation that obama played the race card on him. i don’t think its a coincidence that ferroro was never asked to resign from the campaign. It was part of hillary’s final hail mary attempt to seize the nom: divide among race, gender (ferraro also calle him sexist), religion, and throw in a little electioneering (mich and fl, not to mentio the earlier nv caucus lawsuit). came close to working.

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By: Valmiki http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/08/29/dnc_day_4_the_p/comment-page-1/#comment-213964 Valmiki Sat, 30 Aug 2008 07:08:31 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5382#comment-213964 <blockquote>He's got a paper thin resume in policy, legislative accomplishments and executive leadership</blockquote> <p>Firstly, this argument is effectively neutralized by McCain's selection of Palin as his running mate.</p> <p>Secondly, history tells us that some of the worst presidents were also the most experienced while the greatest american president Abraham Lincoln had a resume remarkably similar to Obama's, as Al Gore pointed out yesterday:</p> <p>http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/feature/2008/08/28/gore/index.html</p> <p>"A century and a half ago, when America faced our greatest trial, the end of one era gave way to the birth of another. The candidate who emerged victorious in that election is now regarded by most historians as our greatest president. Before he entered the White House, Abraham Lincoln's experience in elective office consisted of eight years in his state legislature ... and one term in Congress -- during which he showed the courage and wisdom to oppose the invasion of another country that was popular when it started but later condemned by history. The experience Lincoln's supporters valued most in that race was his powerful ability to inspire hope in the future at a time of impasse. He was known chiefly as a clear thinker and a great orator ... In 2008, once again, we find ourselves at the end of an era with a mandate from history to launch another new beginning. And once again, we have a candidate whose experience perfectly matches an extraordinary moment of transition."</p> He’s got a paper thin resume in policy, legislative accomplishments and executive leadership

Firstly, this argument is effectively neutralized by McCain’s selection of Palin as his running mate.

Secondly, history tells us that some of the worst presidents were also the most experienced while the greatest american president Abraham Lincoln had a resume remarkably similar to Obama’s, as Al Gore pointed out yesterday:

http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/feature/2008/08/28/gore/index.html

“A century and a half ago, when America faced our greatest trial, the end of one era gave way to the birth of another. The candidate who emerged victorious in that election is now regarded by most historians as our greatest president. Before he entered the White House, Abraham Lincoln’s experience in elective office consisted of eight years in his state legislature … and one term in Congress — during which he showed the courage and wisdom to oppose the invasion of another country that was popular when it started but later condemned by history. The experience Lincoln’s supporters valued most in that race was his powerful ability to inspire hope in the future at a time of impasse. He was known chiefly as a clear thinker and a great orator … In 2008, once again, we find ourselves at the end of an era with a mandate from history to launch another new beginning. And once again, we have a candidate whose experience perfectly matches an extraordinary moment of transition.”

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By: Valmiki http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/08/29/dnc_day_4_the_p/comment-page-1/#comment-213963 Valmiki Sat, 30 Aug 2008 06:46:22 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5382#comment-213963 <blockquote>which espouses INSANE ideas like the the US deserved 9/11 </blockquote> <p>Actually he was quoting a white scholar who made the point that american foreign policy led to 9/11. Respected scholars have written books saying the same thing. Read Chalmers Johnson's "Blowback" for example. Compare that to the prominent Republican pastors Falwell and Robertson who claimed that 9/11 was God's punishment on America for tolerating abortion and homosexuality! Anyone who thinks for himself can see that the Republican Party is totally in thrall of INSANE pastors :)</p> <blockquote>America and other democracies overthrowing a dictator like Saddam Hussein </blockquote> <p>When are you going to start thinking for yourself bleh? America under Bush propped up a dictator in Pakistan, groveled before arab Sheiks and Kings in Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, UAE and called them "allies" while at the same time claiming to be fighting wars to bring democracy to Iraq and Afghanistan! That is as hypocritical as you can get.</p> which espouses INSANE ideas like the the US deserved 9/11

Actually he was quoting a white scholar who made the point that american foreign policy led to 9/11. Respected scholars have written books saying the same thing. Read Chalmers Johnson’s “Blowback” for example. Compare that to the prominent Republican pastors Falwell and Robertson who claimed that 9/11 was God’s punishment on America for tolerating abortion and homosexuality! Anyone who thinks for himself can see that the Republican Party is totally in thrall of INSANE pastors :)

America and other democracies overthrowing a dictator like Saddam Hussein

When are you going to start thinking for yourself bleh? America under Bush propped up a dictator in Pakistan, groveled before arab Sheiks and Kings in Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, UAE and called them “allies” while at the same time claiming to be fighting wars to bring democracy to Iraq and Afghanistan! That is as hypocritical as you can get.

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By: koffie verkeerd http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/08/29/dnc_day_4_the_p/comment-page-1/#comment-213876 koffie verkeerd Fri, 29 Aug 2008 21:10:22 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5382#comment-213876 <p>bleh in 16 wrote: "chicken-little view of our economic situation (3.3 growth in 2nd quarter)"</p> <p>Um, really, that's your retort? The 3.3% growth in GDP was almost entirely due to exports thanks to your cheapo dollar, both of which are turning the other way now and so cannot continue to fuel growth. <a href="http://www.economist.com/blogs/freeexchange/2008/08/above_the_fold_247.cfm">Also</a>, inflation is high, incomes are dropping, and spending is flat. Just how does that translate to a strong economy?</p> bleh in 16 wrote: “chicken-little view of our economic situation (3.3 growth in 2nd quarter)”

Um, really, that’s your retort? The 3.3% growth in GDP was almost entirely due to exports thanks to your cheapo dollar, both of which are turning the other way now and so cannot continue to fuel growth. Also, inflation is high, incomes are dropping, and spending is flat. Just how does that translate to a strong economy?

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By: Huey http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/08/29/dnc_day_4_the_p/comment-page-1/#comment-213851 Huey Fri, 29 Aug 2008 19:50:19 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5382#comment-213851 <p><i>4 · <b><a href="mailto:moornam@yahoo.com">MoorNam</a></b> <a href="http://www.sepiamutiny.com/sepia/archives/005382.html#comment213824">said</a></i></p> <blockquote>>><i>My parents never they would live to see a black man nominated for any party for President</i> Looks like Geraldine Ferrao was right all along. M. Nam </blockquote> <p>As if Geraldine had to sit in the back of bus when she was a teenager, but I digress.</p> 4 · MoorNam said

>>My parents never they would live to see a black man nominated for any party for President Looks like Geraldine Ferrao was right all along. M. Nam

As if Geraldine had to sit in the back of bus when she was a teenager, but I digress.

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By: TheBrownChamp http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/08/29/dnc_day_4_the_p/comment-page-1/#comment-213848 TheBrownChamp Fri, 29 Aug 2008 19:42:31 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5382#comment-213848 <blockquote>Breaking news: Alaska's Governor Sarah Palin is McCain VP Pick. This changes everything. Initially I had thought McCain would not pick up more than 10% of PUMA votes from Obama. Now, it could very well be the other way around.</blockquote> <p>Werd. McCain just won the election =(.</p> Breaking news: Alaska’s Governor Sarah Palin is McCain VP Pick. This changes everything. Initially I had thought McCain would not pick up more than 10% of PUMA votes from Obama. Now, it could very well be the other way around.

Werd. McCain just won the election =(.

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By: chachaji http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/08/29/dnc_day_4_the_p/comment-page-1/#comment-213846 chachaji Fri, 29 Aug 2008 19:32:01 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5382#comment-213846 <p><i>8 · <b><a href="mailto:moornam@yahoo.com" rel="nofollow">MoorNam</a></b> <a href="http://www.sepiamutiny.com/sepia/archives/005382.html#comment213831">said</a></i></p> <blockquote>Breaking news: Alaska's Governor Sarah Palin is McCain VP Pick.</blockquote> <p>Check out her <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarah_Palin#Pre-gubernatorial_political_experience">Pre-Gubernatorial Political Experience</a>. I can see how Biden could just demolish her in the VP debates. Now if it was Lizzy Dole, or perhaps, Kay Bailey Hutchinson that wouldn't be so easily said. Either could have a more significant swing on the PUMAs (and cougars, and lynxes). I would actually say that once it sinks in that Sarah Palin could be just that heartbeat away from the Presidency if McCain were to win, there might well be a <i>Republican</i> PUMA effect.</p> <p>Also, I hope I'm not the only one here old enough to remember that the Democrats ran Geraldine Ferraro on the ticket 24 years ago - in 1984. Mondale still lost <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:ElectoralCollege1984.svg">every state except his own</a>, Minnesota.</p> 8 · MoorNam said

Breaking news: Alaska’s Governor Sarah Palin is McCain VP Pick.

Check out her Pre-Gubernatorial Political Experience. I can see how Biden could just demolish her in the VP debates. Now if it was Lizzy Dole, or perhaps, Kay Bailey Hutchinson that wouldn’t be so easily said. Either could have a more significant swing on the PUMAs (and cougars, and lynxes). I would actually say that once it sinks in that Sarah Palin could be just that heartbeat away from the Presidency if McCain were to win, there might well be a Republican PUMA effect.

Also, I hope I’m not the only one here old enough to remember that the Democrats ran Geraldine Ferraro on the ticket 24 years ago – in 1984. Mondale still lost every state except his own, Minnesota.

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By: MoorNam http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/08/29/dnc_day_4_the_p/comment-page-1/#comment-213845 MoorNam Fri, 29 Aug 2008 19:18:41 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5382#comment-213845 <p>YesWeCan barfs: <i>Moornam, I get that you are more concerned about your own welfare than that of the country, which is understandable and even justifiable</i></p> <p>Get your high horse nose off the nether regions of my body, and smell some coffee. Stop making personal allegations that make you look like a dim-witted fool.</p> <blockquote> <blockquote> <p><i>get ready for a landslide on November 4.</i></p> </blockquote> </blockquote> <p>I hope you're right. The world is going to be very rough place in the coming years. Most likely Iran will go nuclear, and start supplying rogues like Venezuela with nuclear weapons. The financial system as we have known for the last thirty years will come to an end with a thud. Pakistan and Afghanistan will look like the same country.</p> <p>With all this, I don't want McCain to get elected and take the blame for the mess. There's always 2012.</p> <p>vaariya: >><i>My only regret is Hillary Clinton should have been selected VP. With her, they would have emphatically stomped on McBush.</i></p> <p>If Obama needs Hillary, then why the hell is HE the nominee?!! If nominated, she would not have needed him.</p> <p>M. Nam</p> YesWeCan barfs: Moornam, I get that you are more concerned about your own welfare than that of the country, which is understandable and even justifiable

Get your high horse nose off the nether regions of my body, and smell some coffee. Stop making personal allegations that make you look like a dim-witted fool.

get ready for a landslide on November 4.

I hope you’re right. The world is going to be very rough place in the coming years. Most likely Iran will go nuclear, and start supplying rogues like Venezuela with nuclear weapons. The financial system as we have known for the last thirty years will come to an end with a thud. Pakistan and Afghanistan will look like the same country.

With all this, I don’t want McCain to get elected and take the blame for the mess. There’s always 2012.

vaariya: >>My only regret is Hillary Clinton should have been selected VP. With her, they would have emphatically stomped on McBush.

If Obama needs Hillary, then why the hell is HE the nominee?!! If nominated, she would not have needed him.

M. Nam

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