Comments on: Duh, only Royals can be inbred. http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/02/11/duh_only_royals_1/ All that flavorful brownness in one savory packet Sat, 30 Nov 2013 11:11:28 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Anil CS Rao http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/02/11/duh_only_royals_1/comment-page-4/#comment-197874 Anil CS Rao Tue, 25 Mar 2008 09:35:00 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5019#comment-197874 <p>I'm guilty of this - often due to family and social isolation, kids tend to fall in love, lust or some combination of the two with essentially their close genetic blood relative (of the same generation)</p> <p>...glad all my cousins look like gorillas (these days at least)</p> <p>.....for better or worse - very little can stop the juggernaut or power of love...</p> <p>:first time you feel it, it may make you mad..." Huey Lewis</p> I’m guilty of this – often due to family and social isolation, kids tend to fall in love, lust or some combination of the two with essentially their close genetic blood relative (of the same generation)

…glad all my cousins look like gorillas (these days at least)

…..for better or worse – very little can stop the juggernaut or power of love…

:first time you feel it, it may make you mad…” Huey Lewis

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By: Basim http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/02/11/duh_only_royals_1/comment-page-4/#comment-193968 Basim Sat, 16 Feb 2008 17:20:48 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5019#comment-193968 <p>I'm the product of roughly sixteen generations of cousin marriages. My parents and one set of grandparents were both first cousins as well. And I've failed most of my classes in school. hahahaha My IQ must be in the negatives.</p> I’m the product of roughly sixteen generations of cousin marriages. My parents and one set of grandparents were both first cousins as well. And I’ve failed most of my classes in school. hahahaha My IQ must be in the negatives.

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By: notsoyoungdesi http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/02/11/duh_only_royals_1/comment-page-4/#comment-193825 notsoyoungdesi Fri, 15 Feb 2008 06:21:34 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5019#comment-193825 <p>Am probably a little late to this discussion but as a Christian from Kerala, I understand that it is acceptable to marry a third cousin from the mother's side but from the father's side it is not acceptable to the church to marry any one closer than a seventh cousin. Don't ask me the rationale for this.</p> <p>My wife is a Hindu from Kerala and although - as has been pointed out by others - they are allowed to marry first cousins under certain circumstances, what is striking is that when we meet other Christians from Kerala, it almost invariably turns out that there is a relationship lurking somewhere whether directly or through marriage. We seem to encounter less of this when we meet with Hindus from Kerala.</p> <p>Other Christian mutineers from Kerala will be able to relate to what I am saying because part of the convo when Christian Keralites meet, seems to invariably dwell on the family name (<i>veetu paru</i>) and thereafter there is the invariable identification of relationships. For someone not acquainted with the strictures against Kerala Christians not being allowed to marry relatives, I would not blame them for thinking that Kerala Christians must be a pretty inbred group!</p> Am probably a little late to this discussion but as a Christian from Kerala, I understand that it is acceptable to marry a third cousin from the mother’s side but from the father’s side it is not acceptable to the church to marry any one closer than a seventh cousin. Don’t ask me the rationale for this.

My wife is a Hindu from Kerala and although – as has been pointed out by others – they are allowed to marry first cousins under certain circumstances, what is striking is that when we meet other Christians from Kerala, it almost invariably turns out that there is a relationship lurking somewhere whether directly or through marriage. We seem to encounter less of this when we meet with Hindus from Kerala.

Other Christian mutineers from Kerala will be able to relate to what I am saying because part of the convo when Christian Keralites meet, seems to invariably dwell on the family name (veetu paru) and thereafter there is the invariable identification of relationships. For someone not acquainted with the strictures against Kerala Christians not being allowed to marry relatives, I would not blame them for thinking that Kerala Christians must be a pretty inbred group!

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By: Ponniyin Selvan http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/02/11/duh_only_royals_1/comment-page-4/#comment-193801 Ponniyin Selvan Fri, 15 Feb 2008 02:29:34 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5019#comment-193801 <p>Kairali:</p> <p>Do you have a problem in comprehension?. Get some help.</p> Kairali:

Do you have a problem in comprehension?. Get some help.

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By: vivo http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/02/11/duh_only_royals_1/comment-page-4/#comment-193740 vivo Thu, 14 Feb 2008 20:30:52 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5019#comment-193740 <p>lol my mother told me in 06 or 07 that she wanted to set me up with my cousin. i was aghast. tambram from a small village in palghat (palakkad) district in Kerala.</p> lol my mother told me in 06 or 07 that she wanted to set me up with my cousin. i was aghast. tambram from a small village in palghat (palakkad) district in Kerala.

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By: Kairali http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/02/11/duh_only_royals_1/comment-page-4/#comment-193720 Kairali Thu, 14 Feb 2008 18:50:08 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5019#comment-193720 <p><i>186 · <b>Ponniyin Selvan</b> <a href="http://www.sepiamutiny.com/sepia/archives/005019.html#comment193648">said</a></i></p> <blockquote>The reason why people are claiming it (marriages within the family) is not present in Kerala is because there are a far fewer Hindus in Kerala, they are either in a minority ( less than 50% ) or just hovering above 50%, so their influence is not that much and people might not be aware.</blockquote> <p>Yes, there are practically no Hindus left:</p> <blockquote>Kerala's principal religions are Hinduism (56.1%), Islam (24.7%), and Christianity (19%). [<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kerala">link</a>]</blockquote> <p>To me, "56%" is not just hovering over 50%, nor does it scream "endangered minority". But don't let facts or reality get in the way of myth-making. One state in India doesn't have an overwhelming number of Hindus vs. other religious adherents and it's a crisis!</p> 186 · Ponniyin Selvan said

The reason why people are claiming it (marriages within the family) is not present in Kerala is because there are a far fewer Hindus in Kerala, they are either in a minority ( less than 50% ) or just hovering above 50%, so their influence is not that much and people might not be aware.

Yes, there are practically no Hindus left:

Kerala’s principal religions are Hinduism (56.1%), Islam (24.7%), and Christianity (19%). [link]

To me, “56%” is not just hovering over 50%, nor does it scream “endangered minority”. But don’t let facts or reality get in the way of myth-making. One state in India doesn’t have an overwhelming number of Hindus vs. other religious adherents and it’s a crisis!

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By: Roger http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/02/11/duh_only_royals_1/comment-page-4/#comment-193664 Roger Thu, 14 Feb 2008 16:15:09 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5019#comment-193664 <p>"Are young Pakistani men in the UK being forced into cousin marriages, or are they choosing to get married to girls in rural Pakistan?"</p> <p>I don't know, JGandhi, and my knowledge is limited to personal observattion that acquaintances with ancestors from the Indian subcontinent, whatever their religion, do seem to marry cousins from home more often than is statistically expected. At a guess, this is from a desire to keep family ties despite geographical distance; indeed, if they lived in the same place as their kindred there might not be the same emphasis on it as there seems to be.</p> “Are young Pakistani men in the UK being forced into cousin marriages, or are they choosing to get married to girls in rural Pakistan?”

I don’t know, JGandhi, and my knowledge is limited to personal observattion that acquaintances with ancestors from the Indian subcontinent, whatever their religion, do seem to marry cousins from home more often than is statistically expected. At a guess, this is from a desire to keep family ties despite geographical distance; indeed, if they lived in the same place as their kindred there might not be the same emphasis on it as there seems to be.

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By: Ponniyin Selvan http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/02/11/duh_only_royals_1/comment-page-4/#comment-193648 Ponniyin Selvan Thu, 14 Feb 2008 14:47:08 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5019#comment-193648 <blockquote>I'm certain that some Hindus in Kerala marry their cousins; I had a classmate who knew that he was going to marry his cousin right from the time they were kids (she was his "murapennu"). </blockquote> <p>I'd assume that the South Indian Hindu culture starting with food habits and marriage practises are the same (though could differ across castes) and I think mostly that assumption is right. The reason why people are claiming it (marriages within the family) is not present in Kerala is because there are a far fewer Hindus in Kerala, they are either in a minority ( less than 50% ) or just hovering above 50%, so their influence is not that much and people might not be aware.</p> <p>Regarding "gotra", I think it is a big deal for Brahmins / upper castes, but not so for lower castes. I have heard the priests ask for Gothra when they do certain rituals like performing a puja / "thithi" commemorating your dead ancestors. I believe the sanskrit slokas differ gothra wise. But for marriage alliances gotra is not a major blocker.</p> <p>I'd not worry too much about cousin marriages contributing to the genetic disorders. Not being a geneticist, I think it is a game of probability (and increase of risk from 2% to 4% is not that high), and I'd assume people take the risk for a "hot" cousin if it is allowed in their "cultural" groups. I never knew that marrying "cross cousins" was taboo in North India for long.</p> I’m certain that some Hindus in Kerala marry their cousins; I had a classmate who knew that he was going to marry his cousin right from the time they were kids (she was his “murapennu”).

I’d assume that the South Indian Hindu culture starting with food habits and marriage practises are the same (though could differ across castes) and I think mostly that assumption is right. The reason why people are claiming it (marriages within the family) is not present in Kerala is because there are a far fewer Hindus in Kerala, they are either in a minority ( less than 50% ) or just hovering above 50%, so their influence is not that much and people might not be aware.

Regarding “gotra”, I think it is a big deal for Brahmins / upper castes, but not so for lower castes. I have heard the priests ask for Gothra when they do certain rituals like performing a puja / “thithi” commemorating your dead ancestors. I believe the sanskrit slokas differ gothra wise. But for marriage alliances gotra is not a major blocker.

I’d not worry too much about cousin marriages contributing to the genetic disorders. Not being a geneticist, I think it is a game of probability (and increase of risk from 2% to 4% is not that high), and I’d assume people take the risk for a “hot” cousin if it is allowed in their “cultural” groups. I never knew that marrying “cross cousins” was taboo in North India for long.

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By: Johnson http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/02/11/duh_only_royals_1/comment-page-4/#comment-193647 Johnson Thu, 14 Feb 2008 14:46:24 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5019#comment-193647 <p>"johnson, you seem to be describing southern indian (if anything) traditions. What you are talking about certainly does not hold true in the North.</p> <p>I think the real hard-core gotra system in the true sense only applies to southern brahmins."</p> <p>Perhaps that is so. I'm not too sure how it is in the North. So North Indian brahmins don't use the gotra system?</p> <p>Regardless, as many south indians hindus DO practise cousin marriage, how can it be considered taboo according to hindu dharma, as these people are clearly hindu?</p> “johnson, you seem to be describing southern indian (if anything) traditions. What you are talking about certainly does not hold true in the North.

I think the real hard-core gotra system in the true sense only applies to southern brahmins.”

Perhaps that is so. I’m not too sure how it is in the North. So North Indian brahmins don’t use the gotra system?

Regardless, as many south indians hindus DO practise cousin marriage, how can it be considered taboo according to hindu dharma, as these people are clearly hindu?

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By: UberMetroMallu http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2008/02/11/duh_only_royals_1/comment-page-4/#comment-193644 UberMetroMallu Thu, 14 Feb 2008 14:14:30 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=5019#comment-193644 <p>I'm certain that some Hindus in Kerala marry their cousins; I had a classmate who knew that he was going to marry his cousin right from the time they were kids (she was his "murapennu"). I know that they were madly in love and wrote to/called each other regularly when he was 15 and in Boarding School; having a girlfriend at that age <i>and</i> his parents being cool with that made him quite popular. The only reference that I could pick up from a bit of googling was from <a href="http://www.mapsofindia.com/maps/kerala/people-culture-and-festivals/matrimony.html">this </a>site:</p> <blockquote>It is also worth mention here that all Hindu communities in Kerala except the Namboodiris practiced cousin marriage. A boy could rightfully claim the hand of the daughter of his maternal uncle or paternal aunt, in marriage. Among Muslims cousin marriage is a common practice but Christians never marry among their blood relations and cousins. </blockquote> I’m certain that some Hindus in Kerala marry their cousins; I had a classmate who knew that he was going to marry his cousin right from the time they were kids (she was his “murapennu”). I know that they were madly in love and wrote to/called each other regularly when he was 15 and in Boarding School; having a girlfriend at that age and his parents being cool with that made him quite popular. The only reference that I could pick up from a bit of googling was from this site:

It is also worth mention here that all Hindu communities in Kerala except the Namboodiris practiced cousin marriage. A boy could rightfully claim the hand of the daughter of his maternal uncle or paternal aunt, in marriage. Among Muslims cousin marriage is a common practice but Christians never marry among their blood relations and cousins.
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