Apologies to all who were offended by Manju’s “inner Jew” comments — this is indeed an offensive phrase, which borders on anti-Semitism. We did not catch the comments when they were initially made.

.

i used maloclm to back up my belief in embracing the free market, not to back up my views on the civil rights act.

I do think it’s fucked up to think malcolm’s choice and ascendency was significantly correlated to his skin color (you clarified that you didn’t mean significant, to which I replied you found it significant enough to mention – which I disagreed and still do disagree with)

at first you disputed the whole charge. then when that proved impossible to maintiain you disputed a made up straw man argument (“signifiicantly” correlated. now you don’t think its worth mentioning but apparently NOI scholars do:

… explained that Elijah Muhammad named the light-skinned Malcolm to his first important post in the Na- tion of Islam because of his “complexion’– …

not to mention malcom himslef on the realted issue of elijah’s self-hatred:

You cannot read anything that Elijah Muhammad has ever written that’s pro-African. I defy you to find one word in his direct writings that’s pro-African. You can’t find it. He was as anti-African as he was anti-white.

or as one scholar puts it:

Malcolm realized that the Nation of Islam’s genealogical myth deprived members of the truth about their African origin. Noble Drew Ali and Elijah Muhammad internalized racism to the extent that despite attempting to subvert racist ideology, they appropriated it. Malcolm X sought to revolutionize Black historiographies, rather than merely manipulate the European versions already in place. His comments concerning Elijah Muhammad’s treatment of Africa in his teachings show that in his last months Malcolm was also critiquing the Black Nationalist tradition from which he sprang.

but in your world, this is probably not worth mentioning.

no, I haven’t reversed it. because reading your preceeding statement:

“I not really opposed to civil rights legislation, i just think its more or less irrelevant to the liberation of POC, which rests on the embrace of weber’s “protestant work ethic” something a close reading of Malcolm X’s work reveals.”

and even then, your statement on civil rights legislation was in response to asha’s statement regarding the role of racism w/respect to economic empowerment:

“Someone like you Manju, a south Asian American, more than likely wouldn’t be able, in the United states, to reap the rewards of the market if it wasn’t for govt intervention” (#406)

implies that you believe combating racism through legislation is irrelevent, then you proceed to graft Malcolm’s words to support this belief. Your belief is not what I condemned, it’s only your attempt to syphon Malcolm’s words that support you, disingenuously casting away the ones that are in direct contradiction.

nor did I reverse the noi colorism stance,

I do think it’s fucked up to think malcolm’s choice and ascendency was significantly correlated to his skin color (you clarified that you didn’t mean significant, to which I replied you found it significant enough to mention – which I disagreed and still do disagree with)

actually, upon further consideration, i reverse my stand. if his organization opposed the spread of gambling then his gambling is fair game.

yes, i quote rush. i also quote that ol totalitarian thinker marx. it takes a lot for me to complete dismiss a thinker. i’m a liberal. so i don’t dismiss easily. which explains why i still admire malcolm depite being repulsed by parts of him. you’d be surprised by how much feminism i’ve read too.

no. he always supported economic self-sufficiency. that was the noi position as i’ve stated. his trranistion was dropping the noi racism while still keeping a certain level of “clannishness” in order to fight racism, ie using a jewish methodology.

Then you proceeded to say because the OAAU refused white funding (implying this was part of his “transition”), it was him finding his “inner jew”? The implication here is this is some new development in Malcolm’s thinking (which it isn’t)

your right. in this sense he found his inner jew when he was with the noi. its not a new devolpment. i agree.

Again, no mention of his firmly held belief that racism was a White American problem

i didn’t mention it b/c i don’t dispute it. unlike your characteriztion of malcom advocating a “protestant work ethic” as as close-minded reading, a position you’ve apparently reversed, just as you were forced to reverse your position that the contention that malocm benifteed from his light skin within the NOI wwas “fucked up shit” or somehing or the sort,

if you disagree with bennett just say it. why attack him personally? if he was opposed to gambling i’d understand but your own quotes prove he is not. ok, his organization opposed a spread…still very much a stretch. you’d be right ot go after him for adultery though, just as people were right to go after clinton for his sexual behaviour in the workplace. hypocrisy.

By the way, how is this a strawman, or mischaracterization of your argument? Isn’t your point that Malcolm’s transition was from reverse-racist to supporter of economic self-sufficiency, who believed that all that’s needed is to band together and build for yourself (as the Jews did):

which rests on the embrace of weber’s “protestant work ethic” something a close reading of Malcolm X’s work reveals (#408)

Then you proceeded to say because the OAAU refused white funding (implying this was part of his “transition”), it was him finding his “inner jew”? The implication here is this is some new development in Malcolm’s thinking (which it isn’t)

the oaau aspired to create a bank to help blacks. advocating economic freedom with a certain level of clannishness to counter discrimination (a clannishness that would be outlawed by the 64 civil rights act). Malcolm had found his inner jew. (#412)

Again, no mention of his firmly held belief that racism was a White American problem, that White Americans had to solve amongst their own. which would be integral to blacks achieving self-sufficiency, because Malcolm wasn’t preaching Garveyism, the establishment of a separate sovereign black state within the US.

So while the “yeehaw” is certainly hyperbole, I don’t see how it mischaracterizes your myopic viewpoint on the issue?

you can read Bennet on race here. I’ve never heard him address the underlying cause, though that doesn’t mean he hasn’t, but i don’t think there is any disagreement as to what that is: white racism, slavery, and jim crow. Are you saying that bennet or other conservatives dispute this? I think the disagreement is on how to proceed, with bennet taking malcolms side as opposed to kings. here he acknowledges pervasive white racism:

American history testifies eloquently that black accomplishment can occur despite pervasive white racism. It would be fool hearty to consider the absence of white racist as a precondition for black achievement

This discussion wasn’t even about the NOI, only that they believed in promoting black self sufficiency, and economic & ideological independence from anyone else (if not moreso), just as much as the OAAU. I don’t see how this is disputable

.

which is why no one disputed it.