Comments on: Further Conversational Excursions with our Community’s Future http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2007/03/28/further_convers_1/ All that flavorful brownness in one savory packet Sat, 30 Nov 2013 11:11:28 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Sadaiyappan http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2007/03/28/further_convers_1/comment-page-3/#comment-125700 Sadaiyappan Sun, 01 Apr 2007 01:09:38 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=4288#comment-125700 <p>This Kal Penn I think is too young to be teaching as a professor ! He doesn't know enough yet..</p> <p>I think he is just saying what his hollywood buddies have been telling him about politics and culture for the last few years..</p> This Kal Penn I think is too young to be teaching as a professor ! He doesn’t know enough yet..

I think he is just saying what his hollywood buddies have been telling him about politics and culture for the last few years..

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By: Ennis http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2007/03/28/further_convers_1/comment-page-3/#comment-125489 Ennis Fri, 30 Mar 2007 21:35:14 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=4288#comment-125489 <blockquote>also wondered about the reasons behind why the screen name was gujarati or the patel-jokes were made.</blockquote> <p>Mishi - it's quite simple. The original IM chat concerned two Kal Penn obsessed girls. It made sense for one of them to have been admitted to Penn but turned it down. Why might somebody turn down Penn? Because it's too close to home. Well, if you look at those constraints, it's logical to imagine that these girls would be Gujarati.</p> <p>But beyond that, this was such gentle ribbing and riffing on stereotypes that I'm amazed that you, or anybody else, took offense. You're right - this is not a PBS introduction to all things SouthAsian where we never tease, poke fun, or kid around. It's simply not that. We're a bunch of adults with a snarky ironic sensibility. We stay far far away from ugly stereotypes because they're ugly and they're not funny. But this? Just because it's not syrupy sweet jalebi like ethnic pride doesn't mean that it's Russel Peters style in your face comedy.</p> also wondered about the reasons behind why the screen name was gujarati or the patel-jokes were made.

Mishi – it’s quite simple. The original IM chat concerned two Kal Penn obsessed girls. It made sense for one of them to have been admitted to Penn but turned it down. Why might somebody turn down Penn? Because it’s too close to home. Well, if you look at those constraints, it’s logical to imagine that these girls would be Gujarati.

But beyond that, this was such gentle ribbing and riffing on stereotypes that I’m amazed that you, or anybody else, took offense. You’re right – this is not a PBS introduction to all things SouthAsian where we never tease, poke fun, or kid around. It’s simply not that. We’re a bunch of adults with a snarky ironic sensibility. We stay far far away from ugly stereotypes because they’re ugly and they’re not funny. But this? Just because it’s not syrupy sweet jalebi like ethnic pride doesn’t mean that it’s Russel Peters style in your face comedy.

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By: Neal (with no 'e') http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2007/03/28/further_convers_1/comment-page-3/#comment-125484 Neal (with no 'e') Fri, 30 Mar 2007 21:31:36 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=4288#comment-125484 <p>Man. As I said at the beginning of that post, I generally enjoy your substantive posts, your "slice of Desi life" stuff, 55 Fridays, and 99% of your posting. I wasn't even going to comment on this post until the rather large post striking out, implying that everyone who didn't particularly like it was attacking you, and suggesting a double standard in the way commenters treat you versus other posters. That was what surprised me. I'm uncomfortable with the idea that not finding something funny would be taken as a personal insult.</p> <p>But this is your site, and I know it sucks when people criticize things that you (and by "you" I mean anyone) write. But that's a risk with creative endeavors, isn't it? And as long as it's not personally insulting (and yes, I know that some commenters on this site ARE personally insulting), aren't those negative reactions a common, predictable feature of a comment-heavy blog like this?</p> <p>As for this:</p> <blockquote>I'm getting a little sick of the following three statements: "Oh no, now the Anna-fans will attack me"..."I'm sure this will get deleted"..."watch me get banned" are all grating and unnecessary. I've done the least amount of the latter two and as for the first, well, I don't control how so-called "fans" react and whether they stand up for me.</blockquote> <p>I was not trying to say "oh poor me, my post will be deleted, whine whine free speech". I absolutely believe the mods of this site have the right to set the norms of discussion however they want to. You're providing a space for us, and that's awesome. My intent in writing about deletion was to make clear that I wasn't going to be offended or turn into some tenacious troll if the mods felt that post crossed the line. I apologize if it looked like I was acting put upon -- sometimes I think the lack of tone in these online discussions can lead to overcommunication :(</p> Man. As I said at the beginning of that post, I generally enjoy your substantive posts, your “slice of Desi life” stuff, 55 Fridays, and 99% of your posting. I wasn’t even going to comment on this post until the rather large post striking out, implying that everyone who didn’t particularly like it was attacking you, and suggesting a double standard in the way commenters treat you versus other posters. That was what surprised me. I’m uncomfortable with the idea that not finding something funny would be taken as a personal insult.

But this is your site, and I know it sucks when people criticize things that you (and by “you” I mean anyone) write. But that’s a risk with creative endeavors, isn’t it? And as long as it’s not personally insulting (and yes, I know that some commenters on this site ARE personally insulting), aren’t those negative reactions a common, predictable feature of a comment-heavy blog like this?

As for this:

I’m getting a little sick of the following three statements: “Oh no, now the Anna-fans will attack me”…”I’m sure this will get deleted”…”watch me get banned” are all grating and unnecessary. I’ve done the least amount of the latter two and as for the first, well, I don’t control how so-called “fans” react and whether they stand up for me.

I was not trying to say “oh poor me, my post will be deleted, whine whine free speech”. I absolutely believe the mods of this site have the right to set the norms of discussion however they want to. You’re providing a space for us, and that’s awesome. My intent in writing about deletion was to make clear that I wasn’t going to be offended or turn into some tenacious troll if the mods felt that post crossed the line. I apologize if it looked like I was acting put upon — sometimes I think the lack of tone in these online discussions can lead to overcommunication :(

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By: Pondatti http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2007/03/28/further_convers_1/comment-page-3/#comment-125483 Pondatti Fri, 30 Mar 2007 21:28:34 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=4288#comment-125483 <p>You can't have it both ways, Mishi.</p> You can’t have it both ways, Mishi.

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By: SP http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2007/03/28/further_convers_1/comment-page-3/#comment-125420 SP Fri, 30 Mar 2007 18:42:29 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=4288#comment-125420 <p>Mishi, I think that's part of the genre - the kids will call each other all sorts of things (ho,'abortion'), it's part of the 'yo mama' style of verbal repartee and teasing. It's a judgement on youth culture if anything, the IM generation. I didn't read it as in any way ethnically indicative, but I suppose we all respond differently to stuff that's said about "ours."</p> <p>As an aside, Anna, I really like the Gujarati slightly sweet raita, that's the one with the mustard in it, no? Sugar is also nice in banana raita. Mmm.</p> Mishi, I think that’s part of the genre – the kids will call each other all sorts of things (ho,’abortion’), it’s part of the ‘yo mama’ style of verbal repartee and teasing. It’s a judgement on youth culture if anything, the IM generation. I didn’t read it as in any way ethnically indicative, but I suppose we all respond differently to stuff that’s said about “ours.”

As an aside, Anna, I really like the Gujarati slightly sweet raita, that’s the one with the mustard in it, no? Sugar is also nice in banana raita. Mmm.

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By: Mishi http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2007/03/28/further_convers_1/comment-page-3/#comment-125412 Mishi Fri, 30 Mar 2007 18:03:01 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=4288#comment-125412 <blockquote>You get to personally interpret whether I was insulting an entire sub-group of the diaspora, despite my not doing so, and then you can turn around and say that my telling the truth is immaterial because it's all about your interpretation. And better yet, you can victoriously reply that I was doing it all subconsciously, when I contradict your claims. Awesome.</blockquote> <p>Why wouldn't I be able to personally interpret what the author of a piece of <u>published</u> work intended when incorporating certain details within their writing? As a reader of this blog, I read the postings, wanted to courteously express my thoughts, and also wondered about the reasons behind why the screen name was gujarati or the patel-jokes were made. It's your article to publish, however I firmly stand by how I approached expressing myself. I'm not concerned about how you <u>personally</u> feel about any ethnic group, but I was interested in knowing what your artistic motivation was. This is exactly why I used Russell Peters as an example, because while reading these postings I experienced the same uncomfortable feeling I did while watching his shows. Do I think Russell Peters himself is actually prejudiced against every ethnic group he mentions in his routine? I don't know, and I really don't care either. What <i>does</i> interest me are his personal experiences that he drew from in order tell the jokes that he did. As an artist, he publicly performs his routine, and I as a member of the viewing public will interpret his work, form opinions, and express them as I feel.</p> <blockquote>but there's no evidence you point to except for a screen name, and as others have pointed out, people use those sorts of names all the time </blockquote> <p>There's no doubt that people use these screen names all the time, and that's fine. Reading about a fictional gujarati character making statements like "wtf not my fault her parents were so f ing slow to pop out lil patelz" was something that, as I have stated before, riled certain emotions and I wanted to express them. I'm not here to build a case file of evidence on why I think anyone hates gujaratis - I wanted to know if the author intentionally chose to create a piece of work that specifically incorporated a borderline illiterate gujarati character, and if so, I further pondered what motivated the author to do so. If it was just a random ethnic choice, then so be it, but I still wanted to share my discomfort that this piece of writing incited and wondered if others had experienced the same emotion either after reading these postings or perhaps even in other situations.</p> You get to personally interpret whether I was insulting an entire sub-group of the diaspora, despite my not doing so, and then you can turn around and say that my telling the truth is immaterial because it’s all about your interpretation. And better yet, you can victoriously reply that I was doing it all subconsciously, when I contradict your claims. Awesome.

Why wouldn’t I be able to personally interpret what the author of a piece of published work intended when incorporating certain details within their writing? As a reader of this blog, I read the postings, wanted to courteously express my thoughts, and also wondered about the reasons behind why the screen name was gujarati or the patel-jokes were made. It’s your article to publish, however I firmly stand by how I approached expressing myself. I’m not concerned about how you personally feel about any ethnic group, but I was interested in knowing what your artistic motivation was. This is exactly why I used Russell Peters as an example, because while reading these postings I experienced the same uncomfortable feeling I did while watching his shows. Do I think Russell Peters himself is actually prejudiced against every ethnic group he mentions in his routine? I don’t know, and I really don’t care either. What does interest me are his personal experiences that he drew from in order tell the jokes that he did. As an artist, he publicly performs his routine, and I as a member of the viewing public will interpret his work, form opinions, and express them as I feel.

but there’s no evidence you point to except for a screen name, and as others have pointed out, people use those sorts of names all the time

There’s no doubt that people use these screen names all the time, and that’s fine. Reading about a fictional gujarati character making statements like “wtf not my fault her parents were so f ing slow to pop out lil patelz” was something that, as I have stated before, riled certain emotions and I wanted to express them. I’m not here to build a case file of evidence on why I think anyone hates gujaratis – I wanted to know if the author intentionally chose to create a piece of work that specifically incorporated a borderline illiterate gujarati character, and if so, I further pondered what motivated the author to do so. If it was just a random ethnic choice, then so be it, but I still wanted to share my discomfort that this piece of writing incited and wondered if others had experienced the same emotion either after reading these postings or perhaps even in other situations.

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By: coffeescoop http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2007/03/28/further_convers_1/comment-page-3/#comment-125358 coffeescoop Fri, 30 Mar 2007 15:21:57 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=4288#comment-125358 <p>Anna,</p> <p>If it's of any consolation, the only reason I visit is for the incredible variety of posts you and the SM gang come up with. I also heart the SM interns who keep things sane around here.</p> <p>Don't let the nasties get you down. Soldier on!</p> Anna,

If it’s of any consolation, the only reason I visit is for the incredible variety of posts you and the SM gang come up with. I also heart the SM interns who keep things sane around here.

Don’t let the nasties get you down. Soldier on!

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By: saleem sinai http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2007/03/28/further_convers_1/comment-page-3/#comment-125325 saleem sinai Fri, 30 Mar 2007 09:10:22 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=4288#comment-125325 <p>that seemed very much on the money (coming from someone who is about twenty years older than the interlocutors in your story it may not mean much) and a nice updating of the epistolary form. have you read shona ramaya's Re:Mohit which uses email to similar effect. I think you do a much better job at getting at the pulst than kunzru's essays at the genre in his second book. in other words:i think you might find yourself quitting your day job at some point ..</p> that seemed very much on the money (coming from someone who is about twenty years older than the interlocutors in your story it may not mean much) and a nice updating of the epistolary form. have you read shona ramaya’s Re:Mohit which uses email to similar effect. I think you do a much better job at getting at the pulst than kunzru’s essays at the genre in his second book. in other words:i think you might find yourself quitting your day job at some point ..

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By: Nagasai http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2007/03/28/further_convers_1/comment-page-3/#comment-125321 Nagasai Fri, 30 Mar 2007 08:53:14 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=4288#comment-125321 <blockquote>Its horrifying to think that an entire generation might one day talk like this.</blockquote> <p>Oh, let's not be too harsh on the desi cubs and their IM lingo...I remember our elders calling us the "Clueless" generation and wondering how we would, like, totally land jobs and stuff since we all somehow talked like valley girls. Somehow it all worked out. Every generation has to "degrade" culture to some extent...it's like a rite of passage :)</p> Its horrifying to think that an entire generation might one day talk like this.

Oh, let’s not be too harsh on the desi cubs and their IM lingo…I remember our elders calling us the “Clueless” generation and wondering how we would, like, totally land jobs and stuff since we all somehow talked like valley girls. Somehow it all worked out. Every generation has to “degrade” culture to some extent…it’s like a rite of passage :)

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By: Nagasai http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2007/03/28/further_convers_1/comment-page-3/#comment-125318 Nagasai Fri, 30 Mar 2007 08:44:27 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=4288#comment-125318 <p>JayaPrada and HetalDiesel...I love it :)</p> JayaPrada and HetalDiesel…I love it :)

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