Comments on: Living on the margins http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2006/04/15/living_on_the_m/ All that flavorful brownness in one savory packet Sat, 30 Nov 2013 11:11:28 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: RC http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2006/04/15/living_on_the_m/comment-page-1/#comment-55992 RC Tue, 18 Apr 2006 21:29:45 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=3269#comment-55992 <p>GGK, What I am saying is that due to Y2K Indian IT firms got the exposure that they were seeking. They used the exposure beautifully to show what they can do and what other services they can provide. While this was going on due to the internet bubble massive internet infrastructure projects were going on creating the bandwidth needed for a good offshore IT operation. As the internet bubble burst, the infrastructure was already in place and INFY had won over lot of clients by sheer enormity of their talent. Then the flood gates really opened as to cop with the Telecom/internet downturn more and more companies needed more and more work to be outsourced.</p> <p>I lived thru' the whole cycle working in a major Telecom equipment manufacturer. I saw how outsourcing stated and where it is today. In my company there are certain functions that are 70% outsourced now, which were all done by US based employees in 1999.</p> <p>INFY and other Indian IT exporters are a good example of making the most of an opportunity. They were able to do it because of the huge pool of talented people that they can draw upon.</p> GGK, What I am saying is that due to Y2K Indian IT firms got the exposure that they were seeking. They used the exposure beautifully to show what they can do and what other services they can provide. While this was going on due to the internet bubble massive internet infrastructure projects were going on creating the bandwidth needed for a good offshore IT operation. As the internet bubble burst, the infrastructure was already in place and INFY had won over lot of clients by sheer enormity of their talent. Then the flood gates really opened as to cop with the Telecom/internet downturn more and more companies needed more and more work to be outsourced.

I lived thru’ the whole cycle working in a major Telecom equipment manufacturer. I saw how outsourcing stated and where it is today. In my company there are certain functions that are 70% outsourced now, which were all done by US based employees in 1999.

INFY and other Indian IT exporters are a good example of making the most of an opportunity. They were able to do it because of the huge pool of talented people that they can draw upon.

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By: Guru Gulab Khatri http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2006/04/15/living_on_the_m/comment-page-1/#comment-55987 Guru Gulab Khatri Tue, 18 Apr 2006 21:12:57 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=3269#comment-55987 <blockquote>All of these events matter, but over riding all is Y2K and the internet bubble.</blockquote> <p>I disagree. The real reason is availability of large manpower to do this kind of work. Eastern Europe has several locations cheaper than india but no one can assemble large teams there. On the other side so far india has not had a skype coming out of there, this is where eastern european companies are taking advantage of. Y2K was mostly a sham operation. I worked for a company which was forced to hire outside consultants so that it can get a government approved Y2k seal of approval, ow some moron(or criminal as he may have been bribed) refused to budge, without that selling this hw to government entitiy was out of the question Our software was time dependent but not date dependent and it did not have an OS, it was a self contained state machine, yet he refused to have a separate category, so the boss decided to find a cheapest consultant to sit and drink soda and sign off that there is no Y2k bug.</p> All of these events matter, but over riding all is Y2K and the internet bubble.

I disagree. The real reason is availability of large manpower to do this kind of work. Eastern Europe has several locations cheaper than india but no one can assemble large teams there. On the other side so far india has not had a skype coming out of there, this is where eastern european companies are taking advantage of. Y2K was mostly a sham operation. I worked for a company which was forced to hire outside consultants so that it can get a government approved Y2k seal of approval, ow some moron(or criminal as he may have been bribed) refused to budge, without that selling this hw to government entitiy was out of the question Our software was time dependent but not date dependent and it did not have an OS, it was a self contained state machine, yet he refused to have a separate category, so the boss decided to find a cheapest consultant to sit and drink soda and sign off that there is no Y2k bug.

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By: RC http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2006/04/15/living_on_the_m/comment-page-1/#comment-55937 RC Tue, 18 Apr 2006 18:25:04 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=3269#comment-55937 <p>Peterpan,</p> <p>I hope you have heared of a phenomenon called Y2K. It was once in a lifetime thing that did so many changes that its hard to list here. - 1991 forex crisis in India and famous then Finance Minister Manmohan Singh's (and PV Narsimharao at PM) opening up of the economy with the move to make Rupee partially convertible ... Focus on exports to get Forex situation under control ....</p> <p>All of these events matter, but over riding all is Y2K and the internet bubble.</p> <p>BTW Rupee is still not fully convertible.</p> Peterpan,

I hope you have heared of a phenomenon called Y2K. It was once in a lifetime thing that did so many changes that its hard to list here. – 1991 forex crisis in India and famous then Finance Minister Manmohan Singh’s (and PV Narsimharao at PM) opening up of the economy with the move to make Rupee partially convertible … Focus on exports to get Forex situation under control ….

All of these events matter, but over riding all is Y2K and the internet bubble.

BTW Rupee is still not fully convertible.

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By: Razib Ahmed http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2006/04/15/living_on_the_m/comment-page-1/#comment-55926 Razib Ahmed Tue, 18 Apr 2006 17:48:02 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=3269#comment-55926 <p>Tata Consultancy Services Ltd. <a href="http://www.southasiabiz.com/2006/04/tata_consultancy_services_ltd_1.html">will recruit 30,500 Employees</a> in one year. We can expect a lot of rivalry between Infosys, Wipro and TCS in the coming years. The interesting thing is that both TCS and Infosys are trying to hire more non-Indian nationalities. This shows that Indian companies are trying to become global players.</p> Tata Consultancy Services Ltd. will recruit 30,500 Employees in one year. We can expect a lot of rivalry between Infosys, Wipro and TCS in the coming years. The interesting thing is that both TCS and Infosys are trying to hire more non-Indian nationalities. This shows that Indian companies are trying to become global players.

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By: peterpan http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2006/04/15/living_on_the_m/comment-page-1/#comment-55877 peterpan Tue, 18 Apr 2006 07:47:05 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=3269#comment-55877 <blockquote>Just imagine is the exchange rate went back to what it was in 1995, there wont be any margin left for the IT exporters.Thats why there was NO IT exporters in 1994. </blockquote> <p>In 1981 (infy start) and 1991 the exchange rates (INR/USD) were 9.1 and 23 rupees per US dollar. So according to your theory by weakening the currency successively IT exports should have exploded all the way to 1994. In fact the exchange rate was 43 INR/USD in 1999. Which is pretty much what it is right now ~ 45 INR/USD. Yet, look at IT exports from 1981 to 1999 and from 1999 to 2006, the respective currency devaluations of (43/9.1) ~ 80% devaluation and 44/43 ~ no change. Another reason which has been mentioned is the salaries of employees. The major component of IT companies' cost is salaries. Take a look at salary increases between 1994 and 2006 and you can see the minimal impact a 50% weakening is going to have on margins. Salaries at the bottom level have increased by a factor of three and in middle management they are approaching 10-20X increases (anecdotal). Heck people these days have a 30% increase in salary in 1 year.</p> Just imagine is the exchange rate went back to what it was in 1995, there wont be any margin left for the IT exporters.Thats why there was NO IT exporters in 1994.

In 1981 (infy start) and 1991 the exchange rates (INR/USD) were 9.1 and 23 rupees per US dollar. So according to your theory by weakening the currency successively IT exports should have exploded all the way to 1994. In fact the exchange rate was 43 INR/USD in 1999. Which is pretty much what it is right now ~ 45 INR/USD. Yet, look at IT exports from 1981 to 1999 and from 1999 to 2006, the respective currency devaluations of (43/9.1) ~ 80% devaluation and 44/43 ~ no change. Another reason which has been mentioned is the salaries of employees. The major component of IT companies’ cost is salaries. Take a look at salary increases between 1994 and 2006 and you can see the minimal impact a 50% weakening is going to have on margins. Salaries at the bottom level have increased by a factor of three and in middle management they are approaching 10-20X increases (anecdotal). Heck people these days have a 30% increase in salary in 1 year.

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By: chick pea http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2006/04/15/living_on_the_m/comment-page-1/#comment-55863 chick pea Tue, 18 Apr 2006 05:57:40 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=3269#comment-55863 <p>here is some interesting info on the <a href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4531814.stm">ceo</a>...</p> here is some interesting info on the ceo

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By: Guru Gulab Khatri http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2006/04/15/living_on_the_m/comment-page-1/#comment-55770 Guru Gulab Khatri Mon, 17 Apr 2006 22:41:23 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=3269#comment-55770 <blockquote>No one ever asks how Infosys treats its employees. I am close friends with several people in Infosys, and my reaction to what they get: pathetic. They work 10-15 hours every weekend, and have no life. No one looks at this aspect of it. </blockquote> <p>??? Is infy forcing them to do that job...The individuals involved choose to do that. They r free to find another career if they routinely find that they need to take there work into weekends... without knowing individual its a hard thing to say but quite often if that individual is struggling its their inability to not perform in that environment. Maybe your buddies shouldnt work at that kind of job. There may be other companies where they can be more productive and have a life.</p> No one ever asks how Infosys treats its employees. I am close friends with several people in Infosys, and my reaction to what they get: pathetic. They work 10-15 hours every weekend, and have no life. No one looks at this aspect of it.

??? Is infy forcing them to do that job…The individuals involved choose to do that. They r free to find another career if they routinely find that they need to take there work into weekends… without knowing individual its a hard thing to say but quite often if that individual is struggling its their inability to not perform in that environment. Maybe your buddies shouldnt work at that kind of job. There may be other companies where they can be more productive and have a life.

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By: shiva http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2006/04/15/living_on_the_m/comment-page-1/#comment-55661 shiva Mon, 17 Apr 2006 14:55:42 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=3269#comment-55661 <blockquote>I am close friends with several people in Infosys, and my reaction to what they get: pathetic.</blockquote> <p>Is that your reaction or their account of what is happening? Infosys stopped recruitment advertising a while ago. They receive a zillion applications of which about 2% get hired. It's an open job market. Pathetic.</p> I am close friends with several people in Infosys, and my reaction to what they get: pathetic.

Is that your reaction or their account of what is happening? Infosys stopped recruitment advertising a while ago. They receive a zillion applications of which about 2% get hired. It’s an open job market. Pathetic.

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By: Savya http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2006/04/15/living_on_the_m/comment-page-1/#comment-55633 Savya Mon, 17 Apr 2006 09:03:37 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=3269#comment-55633 <p>No one ever asks how Infosys treats its employees. I am close friends with several people in Infosys, and my reaction to what they get: pathetic. They work 10-15 hours every weekend, and have no life. No one looks at this aspect of it.</p> No one ever asks how Infosys treats its employees. I am close friends with several people in Infosys, and my reaction to what they get: pathetic. They work 10-15 hours every weekend, and have no life. No one looks at this aspect of it.

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By: Rafi http://sepiamutiny.com/blog/2006/04/15/living_on_the_m/comment-page-1/#comment-55586 Rafi Mon, 17 Apr 2006 03:41:06 +0000 http://sepiamutiny.com?p=3269#comment-55586 <p>1> People, if you dont like MS SW, stop using it. People complain about MS products but then turn around and fire up their windows to do anything. There are options available and unless you start encouraging those options (Mac, linux, whatever) MS would continue to have the market share they have. Please do not use the point I am trying to make to start another argument about MS hegemony of the operating system world. They may be good or bad, smart or stupid . . they are selling you just another product like everyone, if you dont like their product, stop using it.</p> <p>2> The profit margin Infosys is making has less to with the exchange rate and more with the cost of labor in India and plain economics. Just because exchange rate was USD 1 = INR 35 many years back does not mean much. If that was the case then India would be exporting everything rather than importing stuff. In case you read basic economics, it will tell you that demand and supply would decide what is the exchange rate. We are not a managed exchange rate economy like China.</p> <p>Cheers</p> 1> People, if you dont like MS SW, stop using it. People complain about MS products but then turn around and fire up their windows to do anything. There are options available and unless you start encouraging those options (Mac, linux, whatever) MS would continue to have the market share they have. Please do not use the point I am trying to make to start another argument about MS hegemony of the operating system world. They may be good or bad, smart or stupid . . they are selling you just another product like everyone, if you dont like their product, stop using it.

2> The profit margin Infosys is making has less to with the exchange rate and more with the cost of labor in India and plain economics. Just because exchange rate was USD 1 = INR 35 many years back does not mean much. If that was the case then India would be exporting everything rather than importing stuff. In case you read basic economics, it will tell you that demand and supply would decide what is the exchange rate. We are not a managed exchange rate economy like China.

Cheers

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